Americans continue to prefer Trump on handling the economy: Susan Page
'Fox News Sunday' panelists discuss former President Trump and Vice President Harris' expected performance during the upcoming ABC Presidential Debate.
This is a rush transcript of ‘Fox News Sunday’ on September 8, 2024. This copy may not be in its final form and may be updated.
SHANNON BREAM, FOX NEWS ANCHOR: Former President Donald Trump and Vice President Kamala Harris prepare to go head-to-head for the first time on the debate stage in battleground Pennsylvania.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
DONALD TRUMP (R), FORMER U.S. PRESIDENT & 2024 PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: She was in charge of the border. It's the worst border in the history of the world. There's never been a country that allowed 21 million people to come in over a three-year period.
KAMALA HARRIS (D), VICE PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES & 2024 PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: He plans to give billionaires massive tax cuts and to cut corporate taxes by over a trillion dollars even as they pull in record profits.
BREAM (voice-over): The candidates going on the attack over the top issues for voters, from the border crisis to the economy, and guns after yet another school shooting in America -- all sure to come up at Tuesday's debate.
We'll hear from senators from both sides of the aisle, Republican John Cornyn, who represents the key border state of Texas, which has struggled to deal with millions of migrants, and Connecticut Democrat Chris Murphy, a Harris-Walz campaign surrogate.
Then --
REPORTER: Do you think your father might pardon you now that he's no longer running for re-election?
BREAM: A twist in the Hunter Biden saga as the embattled first son pleads guilty to federal tax evasion charges, sparing the family a lengthy and potentially embarrassing trial.
We'll get reaction from our Sunday panel who also weigh in on how judges in two of Trump's four criminal cases may test the bounds of his Supreme Court presidential immunity victory.
All, right now, on "FOX News Sunday".
(END VIDEOTAPE)
BREAM (on camera): Hello from FOX News in Washington.
Here's a look at some of your headlines:
A manhunt underway this morning in southeastern Kentucky after several people were hurt in a shooting and a crash on I-75. The sheriff's office says five people were shot, all are in stable condition, two other people were injured in a vehicle crash during all the confusion. Authorities do not think the gunfire was sparked by road rage. The search for the shooter resumed at daybreak.
Hundreds of thousands of protesters took to the streets in Tel Aviv this weekend, calling for Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu to reach an agreement with Hamas to release the rest of the Israeli hostages.
And former President Donald Trump and Vice President Kamala Harris are gearing up for the ABC presidential debate on Tuesday. In a moment, we'll bring in two senators to discuss the stakes, Texas Republican John Cornyn and Connecticut Democrat Chris Murphy.
But, first, we're going to give you some live team coverage of the campaign. Alexis McAdams live in Pittsburgh following the Harris team, but we begin with Rich Edson live in Hudson, Wisconsin with the Trump team.
Hey, Rich.
RICH EDSON, FOX NEWS SENIOR NATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Hi, Shannon.
Former President Donald Trump's final campaign event before Tuesday's debate, at least that's on his schedule, it was a rally here in Wisconsin part of the northern Midwest blue wall the Democrats will likely have to defend if they want to maintain control of the White House.
The president began the rally. His airplane flew a few hundred feet above the tarmac at Mosinee, Wisconsin, a conservative area, about 90-minute drive west of Green Bay. In a speech lasting 100 minutes, the former president said he'd raise tariffs, secure the border and have the war in Ukraine finished, done and settled before Inauguration Day.
He touted his VP pick, Senator J.D. Vance, and Robert F. Kennedy Jr. who suspended his campaign to endorse Trump.
He called the current administration stupid and corrupt.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
TRUMP: He is the worst president in history. She will be worse than him. She will be worse than him, and Trump is never wrong. I am never ever wrong.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
EDSON: Trump's been outlining plans for the economy. On top of tariffs, he's pushing a new commission on government efficiency led by Elon Musk. He says he also wants to cut regulations, in taxes. Democrats say his proposals are little more than a giveaway to the rich.
Now, we asked the Trump campaign how the former president is preparing for Tuesday's debate, campaign official responded, what's debate prep? Shannon?
BREAM: Okay, we'll see how that pans out.
Rich Edson, reporting from Hudson, Wisconsin, thank you.
Joining us now, Alexis McAdams, live in Pittsburgh where the prep is a little bit different.
Hello, Alexis.
ALEXIS MCADAMS, FOX NEWS CORRESPONDENT: That's right, Shannon. Trump might not be preparing and locked away in a room. He might be at rallies, but that's not the case here in Pittsburgh, Pennsylvania, where Kamala Harris, the vice president, has been in a hotel for a few days, really hunkering down and trying to prep to get ready to take on Donald Trump on the debate stage on Tuesday.
She basically said it's like cramming for finals, right? Where you can't wait to get out and the getting out part was the best part. Watch.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
HARRIS: Being at this spice store I finally got out of the debate prep, to look at these spices, best part of debate prep so far.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
MCADAMS: But it was not just a visit to any spice store, Shannon. The vice president stopped at Penzeys Spices in downtown Pittsburgh. Penzeys is known for posting attacks about the GOP. The nationwide chain even offered a discount the other month to celebrate Trump's indictments, sending this out in an email, saying: Re-indicted and it feels so good, and calling that spice "Justice".
The Trump team firing back about that stop, saying: Sorry, Kamala, scary spice is already taken.
Despite being at that shop Harris says America is ready to move on from political attacks.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
HARRIS: Look, it's time to turn the page on the divisiveness. It's time to bring our country together, charting a new way forward.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
MCADAMS: Harris also thanking Vice President Dick Cheney and his daughter Liz Cheney for their endorsement.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
HARRIS: I think that what they both as leaders who are well respected are making an important statement that it's okay and if not important to put country above party, and I'm honored to have their support.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
MCADAMS: Ahead of the debate, the Harris campaign says they're not happy with some of ABC's rules, including muted microphones, which it claims will benefit Donald Trump, saying this, quote: We understand that Donald Trump is at risk to skip the debate altogether if we don't do this preferred format. We don't want to jeopardize this debate, so for that reason, we accept this full set of rules.
But they don't seem too happy about it.
Back out here live in Pittsburgh, Shannon, Trump won the coin flip, so he'll get the final word at the debate. We'll have to see what happens -- Shannon.
BREAM: All right. Alexis McAdams from Pittsburgh, thank you so much.
Joining us now, Texas Republican Senator John Cornyn.
Welcome to "FOX News Sunday".
SEN. JOHN CORNYN (R-TX): Great to be with you.
BREAM: So I know last year during the primary season, you had some concerns about whether President Trump was the right way forward for the party. You wanted to know whether he can expand beyond his fervent base which is clearly sticking with him.
Do you think he's done enough to build a coalition outside of that? What does he need to do Tuesday night?
CORNYN: Well, I think he needs to let Kamala Harris talk, something she's been reluctant to do unless she's reading a teleprompter. And I think -- you know, we've seen the polls very close, but mainly, she's coming off of this -- as James Carville called it -- a sugar high, after the coup d'etat that was committed against Joe Biden, and then, of course, the convention.
So I'm looking forward to a repetition of the good debate performance that President Trump had with President Biden and I think -- I think he's up to it.
BREAM: So after that change at the top of the ticket, there's been a lot of new enthusiasm, new fundraising and there is talk about how that's impacting down ballot.
"Politico" says that Republicans are starting to get a little concerned about the fundraising gap, saying this: Panic is starting to set in. The only thing preventing us from having a great night in November is the massive financial disparity our party currently faces. That's from the executive director of the National Republican Senatorial Committee.
He says: Unless something changes drastically in the next weeks, we will lose winnable seats.
Are you worried about this down ballot impact on efforts by the GOP to retake the Senate?
CORNYN: Well, fundraising is important, but so are the issues, so are the quality of the candidates. And I think we have an outstanding group of candidates running for the Senate. I'm optimistic about our chances to regain the majority, and I hope they have enough money to defend themselves and to talk about what they are for, what they would do if elected and I'm confident they will.
But, yeah, the money is just astronomical. It just blows my mind.
BREAM: It really is. I mean, when you watch she's taking in, the millions that have come in just at the presidential race, hundreds of millions just the last few weeks.
Of course, you were in the running to replace Mitch McConnell as the Senate's top Republican. What will your priorities be should you achieve that post and how might that differ if you're dearing (ph) -- dealing with a Harris-Walz administration versus a Trump-Vance administration?
CORNYN: Well, when President Trump is reelected along with my colleague J.D. Vance, I expect we'll be helping the administration pass their agenda and I don't see a lot of daylight between what Republicans in the Senate want to do or know we need to do, things like reauthorize the expiring provisions of the Tax Cuts and Jobs Act. We need to reestablish ourself, our nation, as the preeminent leader in the world when it comes to national security matters under President Biden. Our friends don't trust us and our enemies don't fear us. It was the opposite under President Trump.
So we'll be working very closely with the administration to accomplish their priorities, and I don't really see, as I said, a lot of daylight between what my colleagues in the Senate want to do next year.
We're going to have to also though look at the -- look at the debt. We're now spending more money on interest on the national debt than we are on defense.
And, right now, the world has gotten more dangerous, and most dangerous since World War II. So we have a lot of heavy lifting to do and it'll help the more -- the bigger our majority is.
BREAM: So let's talk about a couple things you mentioned there, the tax cuts. You know, Democrats from the vice president on down say that they are -- President Trump, a rich guy, giving cuts to rich people. And when you talk about the debt that those kinds of tax cuts actually leave a revenue lag for the federal government and contribute to things like the debt.
CORNYN: Well, the American people are not under taxed. The federal government spends too much.
BREAM: Do you mean (ph) both parties do that?
CORNYN: Well, there's some complicity there. Certainly during COVID-19, there was a lot of bipartisan efforts to keep our economy afloat and to help deal with this pandemic.
But there's been a lot of partisan spending, gasoline really on the inflation fire, $2.7 trillion in partisan spending bills post-COVID. But I think we're at an inflection point.
Part of the problem is we spend money in ways that are not just appropriations. We spend $1.8 trillion in the tax code. There's about $200 billion alone that's spent through the child tax credit and the earned income tax credit.
I'm for those but I do think they need to be offset. They need to be paid for. And so, we need to look at all of that $6 trillion in federal spending and determine what our priorities are as a nation. I think that's our job.
BREAM: Well, and we also are about to get to the end of government funding facing another continuing resolution sort of that short-term financial band-aid. It looks like the House is going to send it over with the SAVE Act attached, which basically says if you're going to go register to vote in federal elections, you have to show proof that you're a U.S. citizen.
A number of Senate Democrats have said that's dead on arrival. It's not going to happen.
How worried are you about this thing pinging back and forth and facing a shutdown? Is that going to hurt Republicans in, you know, this final stretch of an election?
CORNYN: Well, Shannon, in a sane world, the SAVE Act would be non- controversial. It essentially is a national voter ID, and I would think both parties and everybody would be interested in protecting the integrity of the ballot, making sure that people only legally qualified to vote do so.
But it's become a partisan issue which is amazing to me, and -- but I don't think there's going to be a shutdown. We'll see -- the House will have to move first and they got to get to 218. And then it comes to the Senate, I hope we'll have a debate and an opportunity to vote on it.
And I can't imagine that Senator Schumer is excited about having his incumbents who were running tough Senate races voting against a bill that just says you have to be an American citizen to vote.
BREAM: That'll be in the next couple of weeks we think.
But I want to touch down the border because, clearly, Texas bears a huge brunt of this and what's going on there. The vice president though has been touting her work. She says she -- she was tough on cartels and gangs and she's litigated against these people, held them accountable.
She also said this in her DNC speech:
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
HARRIS: Last year, Joe and I brought together Democrats and conservative Republicans to write the strongest border bill in decades, the Border Patrol endorsed it. But Donald Trump believes a border deal would hurt his campaign. So he ordered his allies in Congress to kill the deal.
(BOOING)
HARRIS: Well, I refuse to play politics with our security.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
BREAM: I won't be surprised if your colleague, Senator Chris Murphy, brings this up when we talk to him next. It has been a messaging talking point that has stuck for Democrats, this idea that President Trump is the one who kept the border problem alive because he told you guys not to vote for it.
CORNYN: Well, that's just false is a short answer to that. And the truth is that the Biden-Harris administration has spent three and a half years dismantling all of the Trump border security policies that produced a far better outcome at the border.
I was just down in the Rio Grande Valley a couple weeks ago with Senator John Boozman from Arkansas, and the way the Border Patrol explained it to me, they said, this is a shell game.
Now, the federal government if you use the CBP One app, Customs and Border Protection One app, you can schedule an appointment at a port of entry, and the Biden administration -- the Biden-Harris administration will simply usher you into the United States and give you a work permit.
That is a huge magnet on continued illegal immigration. So we need to return to the policies of the previous administration. Remain in Mexico just is one of them, but this is all a shell game in my view.
BREAM: We will see and whoever wins White House, House, Senate, whether it's divided or together, there hasn't been much progress on the issue of immigration. So, we'll see.
Thank you for stopping by. Always good to see you, Senator.
CORNYN: Thanks, Shannon.
BREAM: All right. Up next, less than 60 days until Election Day, both Vice President Harris and former President Trump revealing new details about their economic plans this week. We're going to bring in Harris-Walz campaign surrogate, Senator Chris Murphy, to discuss what Harris is proposing and whether she's actually breaking from President Biden. He's next.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
BREAM: Ahead of Tuesday's showdown, Vice President Kamala Harris is in practice sessions sharpening her attack lines against the former president as a brand new "New York Times/Siena" poll shows the race in a dead heat.
Joining me now, Harris-Walz Campaign Surrogate, Connecticut Senator Chris Murphy, member of the Harris-Walz Campaign's National Advisory Board. Welcome back. Good to see you.
SEN. CHRIS MURPHY (D-CT): Yeah, great to be here.
BREAM: OK. So we're all looking at this debate. There is a lot at stake for both of these candidates, given how tight this race is. Mark Penn, longtime Democratic strategist, worked for both the Clintons, has this to say. He says, "One interview. One debate. Some rah rah stump speech you read over and over. And voila, you have a 50% chance of being president." He goes on to say, "No two years of primaries, coalition building, no detailed policy development, and no daily press briefings or tests of leadership. It's only the most important job in the world, with a $6 trillion budget and thousands of nuclear weapons." He says, "real democracy calls for more debates, more interviews."
Listen, the policy section of the website remains blank last I checked. So when are we going to get more from the Vice President?
MURPHY: Well, I think you have heard the Vice President roll out several very important detailed policy proposals. She just proposed a massive tax cut for small businesses. She's proposed a massive investment in housing to bring the cost of rent and mortgages down for Americans. She's going to go after price gougers to try to make sure that we continue to drive inflation down. She wants an expansion of the child tax credit. She's investing in the middle class.
She's talking about an opportunity agenda where everybody has the chance to succeed, which is very different than Donald Trump's agenda. Donald Trump has made it very clear, if you put him back in power, he's going to think about only one group of people, and that's his friends at Mar-a-Lago, another massive tax cut for the richest people in America.
So I don't doubt that Kamala Harris will continue to roll out proposals to invest in small businesses, to invest in the middle class. I think the contrast is pretty striking between a candidate on the Democratic side who wants to make sure that we grow the economy from the middle out. And Donald Trump, who still believes in this magical thinking of trickle-down economics, where if you give him and his friends billions of dollars, eventually that'll find its way down to everybody else. That's just not how it works.
BREAM: Well, you know there's analysis. These are IRS numbers, so we assume that's neutral data, and they say that every class of taxpayer benefited from the round of tax cuts that came under the Trump administration, that it wasn't just the top 1%, that it really did benefit everybody who pays taxes in any way.
We've also got, this week, in talking about the Vice President's economic rollout, one of the skeptics of her plans wrote this over the "Washington Free Beacon," listening to Harris extol the virtues of enterprise, you'd have no idea that she cast the deciding vote on the spending splurge that drove historic inflation, that her administration has imposed almost $1.4 trillion in regulations, and that she wants to weaken right-to-work laws and wants Congress to pass $5 trillion of new taxes over 10 years.
MURPHY: Well, listen, let's compare the economic record of Donald Trump against the economic record of Joe Biden and Kamala Harris. Under this administration, we have seen record job growth in this country. We have manufacturing booming, unemployment at a record low.
When Donald Trump left office, we had unemployment at a record high. He told us if --
BREAM: We were in the middle of the pandemic, to be fair.
MURPHY: We were going to rebuild the manufacturing sector under Donald Trump. We lost manufacturers' jobs. So there is a clear contrast between Donald Trump's record as president where our economy fell to pieces and Kamala Harris and Joe Biden --
BREAM: In the middle of the pandemic.
MURPHY: -- who have rebuilt the economy. And by the way, driven down inflation at a rate faster than all of our other high-income nation competitors.
BREAM: But, again, President Trump handed off, he will argue I'm sure Tuesday night, an inflation rate of 1.4% in the middle of a pandemic, the majority of jobs lost during the pandemic had come back. We spiked to 9, more than 9%. I mean 40 years we haven't seen those kinds of numbers.
MURPHY: Correct and that happened in every single high-income economy because coming out of the pandemic no country had the supply chains sufficient to be able to withstand the surge in demand, but it is also true that over the last four years, inflation has come down faster in the United States than those other countries.
GDP has grown at a faster rate than those other countries and today we are sitting in an economy where anybody who wants a job can get one because we have record low unemployment.
Donald Trump is advertising that he is going to bring back the same kind of chaotic economic policies the same investment in the top 1% in corporations that helped drive our economy into a ditch during his time in office.
BREAM: OK, again, what he's going to say is poverty was down, home ownership was up, inflation was at 1.4, gas was at 230 something a gallon. I mean he's going to maybe be happy to stand on his policies. And when we poll people they tell us they were doing better under President Trump than they've done under this administration. So they do have a head-to-head comparison.
And on this issue of inflation and where we go from here, there was a study out this summer from a bunch of folks including some MIT professors who said, the research shows that mathematically the overwhelming driver of a burst of inflation in 2022 was federal spending not the supply chain.
I mean, I'm no MIT scholar so I'll defer to them. But he says it was the massive spending that as I talked about with Senator Cornyn, people on both sides of the aisle voted for under this administration. But there were tough things where the Vice President was the tie-breaking vote. She says proudly on the Inflation Reduction Act which President Biden said this week they shouldn't have named it that because that's not what it was.
MURPHY: Although, look at the chart, the minute we pass the Inflation Reduction Act, inflation started to decrease at stunning levels in this country. And by the way, that piece of legislation is growing manufacturing jobs all over the country, is cutting prescription drug costs for senior citizens.
I'm proud of the fact that we are doing our part to try to clean up the environment. I'm proud of the fact that that legislation finally took on the drug industry and said we're not going to put seniors in a position where they go bankrupt because of their prescription drug costs.
Donald Trump was in office for four years he did nothing to take power away from the drug industry. Prescription drug prices skyrocketed under Donald Trump. The Inflation Reduction Act for the first time did something about transferring power from the drug industry to regular people. That's the difference between these two candidates.
Donald Trump is going to put power in the hands of the big corporations. He's promised the big oil industry that he will do anything they want as long as they donate a billion dollars to his reelection campaign.
Kamala Harris says that he's going to continue to take power away from the big oil companies, the big drug companies, the big insurance companies and put that power back in the hands of regular people.
BREAM: Well, one of his -- his arguing points about the economy is he does want to enable, you know, the industry oil and gas industry to do more production. He says we shouldn't be dependent on places that don't have our best interests at heart.
MURPHY: So ask yourself this, were we producing more domestic oil and gas under Donald Trump or under Joe Biden and Kamala Harris? We're producing more domestic oil and gas today under Joe Biden and Kamala Harris than under Donald Trump.
What we are also doing is making historic new investments in renewable energy so we're also bringing much more wind power and solar power onto the grid. What Kamala Harris and Joe Biden have shown is that you can do both. You can continue to develop and explore for oil here in the United States and you can do our part to solve climate change.
Under Donald Trump, we weren't doing either. We were drilling for less oil. We were exploring less gas and we weren't doing anything about the climate crisis.
BREAM: OK let's talk about something else the Vice President put out this week which was raising the corporate tax rate from 21% to 28%. The Joint Committee on Taxation bipartisan congressional entity says that actually would mean even the lowest income Americans, I mean, they would be paying higher taxes. Because of that they say, in reason, puts it this way:
"Higher corporate taxes are passed along to consumers, employees, and investors in the form of high prices, lower wages and lower investment returns. If you buy things, have a job or save for retirement, higher corporate income taxes will fall on you no matter how many times Biden or Harris try to pretend otherwise."
MURPHY: Yeah, I mean, this -- this is obviously the argument made by the billionaire class and the corporate class --
BREAM: OK but by the Joint Committee on Taxation.
MURPHY: If you raise taxes on us, ultimately we will just pass those down to other people. Some people want tax fairness in this country. They are sick and tired of these massive American companies paying 0% tax rates. That's what some of the biggest companies in the country were paying, zero under Donald Trump.
There's nobody in this country Republicans or Democrats that thinks that's fair except for Donald Trump. So yes Kamala Harris believes that if you're a corporation in this country you should pay some taxes. Yes, she believes that if you're making a billion dollars in this economy, you should help pay for our schools. You should help try to make our communities safer.
I don't think Americans believe this argument that by raising taxes by a couple percentage points on a handful of billionaires that, that ultimately is going to ruin the economy.
Kamala Harris also says that she's going to cut taxes on small businesses. She's going to use the money that we raise in higher taxes for billionaires and transfer that to tax cuts for small businesses and low-income taxpayers.
BREAM: All of that's got -- it's got to work out somewhere on the ledger and so that's going to mean more taxes and Joint Taxation Committee says that falls to everyone. So, we will watch to see, if she wins, what you guys do in Congress and how you handle it. But thank you for coming in.
MURPHY: Thanks.
BREAM: Always good to see you.
MURPHY: Appreciate it.
BREAM: All right with the race so tight, Tuesday's debate could be make or break for these candidates. Next up, we've got two debate prep experts who've got some final words of advice for these two. And our panel is here to break down what we're learning about the Trump and Harris economic plans and how they're actually going to impact your wallets. Next.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
TRUMP: It's a disgrace. And honestly, you ought to be ashamed of yourself.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Secretary Clinton.
HILLARY CLINTON, FORMER FIRST LADY OF THE UNITED STATES AND FORMER PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: It's just awfully good that someone with the temperament of Donald Trump is not in charge of the law in our country.
TRUMP: Because you'd be in jail.
HARRIS: To hear you talk about the reputations of two United States Senators who have built their reputations and career on the segregation of race in this country.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
BREAM: Just sampling of how this year's White House contenders have tackled their debate opponents in the past. So will Tuesday be more about substance or style?
I sat down earlier with two campaign veterans who've prepped presidential candidates for this, the debate stage.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
BREAM: Joining me now, former Obama campaign manager, Jim Messina. And GOP communications consultant, Brett O'Donnell, who has prepped several presidential candidates for their debates.
All right. It comes down to this week. This may be the only meeting between these two we get on the stage.
"New York Times" puts it this way. "The debate in Philadelphia on Tuesday will be, by far, the longest unscripted setting for Ms. Harris of her candidacy. A high-risk encounter against an opponent with little regard for decorum."
Jim, who's got more at stake on Tuesday?
JIM MESSINA, FORMER OBAMA CAMPAIGN MANAGER: Oh, she does. I mean, let's be honest, you know, Donald Trump is the best counterpuncher in the history of American politics.
This is his seventh presidential debate over three cycles, and this is her first. And so we're in a tight race. It was -- it was under 60 days by the time we get to the debate. And she has still a bunch of swing voters who don't have an opinion of her or waiting to see who she is and what she's going to stand for. So, you know, I think the advantage is to Trump going into this. But, you know, as we all know, all strategy goes out the moment you get on that debate stage.
BREAM: Well, and I think it's fascinating. These two have never met face to face. Going to a presidential debate for your first meeting is a little bit intimidating. They've got different prep strategies. The vice president holding up in Pittsburgh for several days to hone what she's been working on.
President Trump and his team saying, he does debate prep every day simply by engaging in hostile interviews and doing these press conferences.
But, Brett, I want to play something about what he said he plans to do. Here's President Trump.
TRUMP: When I had Biden, you and I had the same discussion. And I let him talk. I'm going to let her talk because, you know.
BREAM: So, do you think he will be able to just simply sit back and let her explain her positions, get herself maybe into a hole she's got to dig out of?
BRETT O'DONNELL, GOP COMMUNICATIONS CONSULTANT: Well, he did in the first debate, especially for the first 30 minutes. That's where Biden done did himself. I mean, Biden actually fulfilled the one principle of presidential debates.
You can't win an election in one, but you can lose it. Joe Biden did it and it was because the president was more disciplined, particularly in those first 30 minutes.
BREAM: Well, and as for her debate, NBC News reports this about her strategy. They say, "Harris and her team are focusing on homing in on how to needle Trump to rattle him. Another source said the Harris team plans to emphasize what it views as Trump's advanced age and lack of details on policy proposals."
And, Jim, that's -- obviously, we've got different optics than we did about the June debate where President Trump and his team had spent, you know, tens of millions of dollars and invested in this strategy that President Biden was too old and unable to move forward in his campaign. Are the tables turned now?
MESSINA: Well, look, let me make you one guarantee, your first guarantee of this T.V. appearance. There's no way Donald Trump is going to sit back and let her just talk to country about what she wants and what she wants to do.
And the reason is, you know, we're in a tight race. He is -- he is stuck. He can't move over 47 percent. And so he's got to bring her down to him. And so what she wants to do is exactly that.
Her job -- she has two jobs. One is to look at the American public and be presidential. And the second is to draw a very clear contrast between him and her.
I used to say to Obama, if it's a referendum on you, we'll lose. If it's a choice between you and Romney or you and McCain, we will win. And so I think she's going into that exactly.
And Donald Trump, I promise you, is not going to sit there and let her have at it.
BREAM: All right. We'll see. Because it's 90 minutes. It's hard to resist the urge when both of these, you know, are, I would say, have known how to be combative fighter. She's been a federal prosecutor. You see him each time that he gets out there and defends his position.
Here's what we know about the rules. Obviously, no live audience, no opening statements, no props allowed. And candidates' microphones will be muted when their opponent is on the clock, a stipulation that's created controversy in recent days. The two teams fighting about this.
In fact, the Harris campaign, one of the senior advisors sent a letter to ABC which is hosting the event saying this. "Vice President Harris, a former prosecutor will be fundamentally disadvantaged by this format which will serve to shield Donald Trump from direct exchanges with the vice president. We suspect this is the primary reason for his campaign's insistence on muted microphones."
But, Brett, a lot of people who support President Trump actually felt it worked for him this particular rule in that Biden debate.
O'DONNELL: It did work for him from the first debate, but I do think that that message from the Harris campaign is nothing more than a head fake. It's meant to, again, bait the president into a personal debate.
I mean, I think the Harris campaign would love nothing more than if this debate was all about personality and persona and not about policy. Because as long as the debates focused on policy, that means Kamala Harris has to explain the differences between Kamala Harris four years ago and Kamala Harris now, which I think is an opportunity for President Trump to attack her on.
If the debate is about personality, and she can get under his skin, I think that is much better territory for the -- for the Harris campaign.
BREAM: OK. Real quick because we're almost out of time. I want to ask you both the same question. What's your, one, best piece of advice for, Brett, for you, for the Trump campaign?
O'DONNELL: Keep the debate focused on policy, not about persona.
BREAM: And, Jim, your piece of advice to the Harris team.
MESSINA: It's all about future. I would write future above my little white pad on there. And I would never stop putting her in the future and him in the past. And if she does that, she'll be the president of the United States.
BREAM: All right. Jim and Brett, we know you are both be watching as we all will on Tuesday night. Thanks for your insights.
MESSINA: Thank you.
O'DONNELL: Thanks for having us.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
BREAM: All right. Let's see what our Sunday group thinks. "USA Today" Washington Bureau Chief, Susan Page. You'll remember, she moderated the 2020 vice presidential debates. Mary Katharine Ham, Fox News contributor and OutKick columnist. Fox News senior political analyst, Juan Williams. And Guy Benson Townhall.com political editor, Fox News contributor, and host of The Guy Benson Show. Welcome, everybody.
All right. Susan, you have a piece out about this this morning. I mean, you were the last person to moderate a debate that Kamala Harris took part in.
SUSAN PAGE, WASHINGTON BUREAU CHIEF, USA TODAY: That's right. Can you imagine she hasn't debated in four years? That might be a little bit of concern for them that she's rusty.
You know, in that debate, she hadn't been universally good in the primary debates that in -- that in 20 -- in the 2020 cycle, but she was good in the vice presidential debate. She was prepared and she made especially effective use of a putdown of Pence when he interrupted her. This may be one reason they wanted mics to be live.
She said, Mr. Vice President, I'm speaking. And the "Mr. Vice President" sounded very respectful and the, "I'm speaking," made him risk looking disrespectful, if he kept talking over her.
BREAM: Well, we know how much is at stake. "The New York Times" today has brand-new polling saying this. The national poll of likely voters found Mr. Trump leading Miss Harris, 48 to 47 percent. The new poll underscores the risks and potential rewards particularly facing Miss Harris on Tuesday night when she and Trump face off.
I mean, Guy, it couldn't be any closer.
GUY BENSON, FOX NEWS CONTRIBUTOR: Tight race. Trump now slightly back in the lead to that big bounce she got in "The New York Times" poll from the month-long euphoria fueled by the media seems to have dissipated significantly.
And, Shannon, I think the most significant data point within that poll is a question about Jim Messina who was just talking about the future, the change question. A vast majority of Americans in this poll say they want change.
And in this survey, a majority see Donald Trump as an agent of change, and a majority see her as more of the same. That should be Trump's overarching hammered point on Tuesday night.
BREAM: And we saw at the DNC, there was very good messaging casting her as the challenger and him as the incumbent, but it sounds like within this poll, people are starting to have a reality check on that particular issue.
Now, they both rolled out economic plans this week. Reuters says this, citing a Goldman Sachs report. Under a Republican sweep, or even with a divided government led by Donald Trump, economic output would take a hit next year, mostly from increased tariffs on imports and tighter immigration policies, according to Goldman. They say he's not the one for your economy.
MARY KATHARINE HAM, FOX NEWS CONTRIBUTOR: Yes. I think the tariffs are something that I personally disagree with and have some policy issues with. I think he needs to point out, look, I have a vision, she has nothing on her website.
She's giving you a hand -- a sprinkling of proposals that have been frankly widely panned, including this idea of giving individual homeowners this 25K that would up housing prices and end up hurting people.
I think that he can say, look, to the extent that he can connect the reality on the ground of what is happening right now and what people are feeling, people who are not Goldman Sachs, by the way. You can make that point about that division. He wins in the reality on the ground because he says, look what your life was like four years ago and look at it now. Compare the two. And I think that's what he has to drill down on.
BREAM: Well, and that's what this "Hill" opinion piece this week gets to. It says, "If Trump's policies were so terrible, why do so many people think they were better off during his presidency? Why were small-business owners and consumers consistently more upbeat than they have been during the Biden-Harris years?"
I mean, Juan, how does she navigate that reality check that people get every day when they buy groceries?
JUAN WILLIAMS, FOX NEWS SENIOR POLITICAL ANALYST: Well, I think people have a certain nostalgia about the past.
Joe Biden's numbers have gone way up since he decided --
BREAM: Well, now that he's off the ticket.
WILLIAMS: That's what I'm saying. I think people's -- but, you know, the reality is, if you look at the numbers, the economy is better now than it was then.
So you're dealing with this kind of memory sense of things.
BREAM: OK. But what context? Just to -- just to give us a --
WILLIAMS: What the -- what the context is, Goldman Sachs, they're no left- wing organization. They're saying the economy will be better under Kamala Harris.
HAM: They're also not mom buying groceries.
WILLIAMS: And also, I think you also look at -- I think this week there was 88 top executives who came out and said, we think that the economy will spur, will boost under Kamala Harris.
And this week, Trump went before the New York Economic Club to give a speech. And it should have been, you know, given the perception that he wants to say the economy was better, it should have been a knock out for him in front of all those rich men. Instead, he delivered word salad on a question about childcare.
And my sense is, look, the job numbers are good, the stock market is good. And right now, the Federal Reserve is in a position where they're likely to raise -- I'm sorry, lower interest rates.
BREAM: Yes. Please don't say raise.
WILLIAMS: I'm sorry. Right.
Lower interest rates, which will raise, I think, opportunities for Kamala Harris to say, we have a future that's better coming under my administration.
BREAM: Well, Mary Katharine, you mentioned moms out buying groceries. You're a mom of four. That's certainly the circle that you often run in, is to hear from them about what they think.
HAM: Well, and my perspective is, if it's hurting us, I know it's hurting other people much, much more.
And it's hard to argue that the inflation, although the rate of it is falling, you're not getting back to the 1.9 that we had in January 2017, 2016, when Trump was in office, right? And this hurts people.
And your -- and when you talk about the jobs market, yet, we're adding jobs, but it's mediocre at best. And we're revising down every single month to a cumulative number that's taken a pretty big hit on those numbers.
PAGE: You know, nothing more frustrating to the Democrats than the fact that they feel that Biden and Harris do not get the credit they really deserve on the economy we have. We see a little bit of brightening of views.
But the fact is in the New York Times/Siena poll and in the USA Today/Suffolk poll, Trump continues to be preferred when it comes to handling the economy.
The change question is important. The who do you trust more to handle the economy, that is a crucial, basic question.
BENSON: Prices are up 20 percent under Biden and Harris. That's why the frustration is there because the frustration is deserved. Prices are up 20 percent. People feel that.
BREAM: All right. Just --
WILLIAMS: I think people know that we went to a coronavirus. This is what you were stressing earlier with the Senator. And that things had to be done and that this economy is the envy of the world. There's no better economy in the entire world after the virus.
BREAM: And just a quick note here, there are two cases that are out there pending. I just want to make sure, because this race is so tight, RFK Jr. trying to get off the ballots in a number of states, both Michigan and North Carolina appeals courts, they are ruled. He comes off the ballot.
Those have been now appealed to their state's supreme courts. So we stand by this week to see in these critical states where if his name is offer on that ballot, after he fought so hard to get on, now fighting to get off.
OK. Panel, don't go anywhere.
When we come back, college students back on campus and so are those anti- Israel protests. Hear from students who say the problem starts at the top. You'll hear from them next.
And we'll discuss the implications, as tensions escalate in the Middle East and here at home.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
KATIE ARYEH, BARNARD COLLEGE GRADUATE: These are protesters who are being influenced by outside organizations. The Islamic Republic of Iran is thanking them for their work. They are giving permission to these terrorists to continue their horrific acts, like murdering the American hostage, Hersh Goldberg-Polin, after he survived 11 months in captivity and torture.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
BREAM: That was Barnard College graduate from our Fox Nation special "Anti- Semitism on Campus: Back to School."
Anti-Israel protests are starting to pop up again on college campuses as students head back to place - places like Columbia University in New York City this week. Police clashing with protesters and making arrests.
We are back now with our panel.
NBC News says this. "Students are barely back on campus, but pro- Palestinian protests have already returned, putting a divisive issue back in the spotlight that Democrats had hoped the nomination of Vice President Kamala Harris might allow them to move beyond."
Juan, it's not a good look.
WILLIAMS: Well, no. I mean, look, free speech is a right in our country, but there's no place for threats and intimidation and violence.
So, the thing about it is the politics, as you spotlight, Shannon, because the politics is big protests, pro-Palestinian protests, really are being used against the Harris campaign. The suggestion is that, oh, these people are more Democrats. Democrats embrace this chaos and all that.
But the Republicans have a problem with anti-Semitism. I mean this week, to see that Tucker Carlson, who spoke at the GOP convention, is giving a platform to a man who is saying that, you know, Winston Churchill was to blame for the Holocaust and the troubles during World War II, I mean that's just pathetic. That's sick! That's historical revisionism on a scale that's troubling. And I think that lots of people are starting to ask questions about this.
But in terms of the optics, if it's a big pro-Palestinian demonstration, the Republicans hope that, you know, it will be somehow a weight on the Democrats.
BREAM: Well, Mary Katharine, is it more of a problem for Democrats or Republicans, as Juan tries to make the point (ph)?
HAM: Well, one of the reasons that it can be connected to Democrats is because Tim Walz said just this week that the protesters are speaking out for all the right reasons. If you watch tape of these gatherings, yes, free speech is in action here. And the problem with colleges is they haven't been able to find the line between speech and vandalism and threats and violence. And at UCLA, blocking Jewish students from going to certain parts of campus. That was on a right-wing action happening there. But that's what I can be connected to them.
It can be connected to them also because they seem to be making, because of Walz's statement, they seem to be making political calculations about Michigan voters based upon how much they're able to come out and condemn these kind of things.
WILLIAMS: But I don't think - I think -
HAM: Although, I think Kamala Harris has had moments where she's gone there and been clear about these protesters.
WILLIAMS: I was just going to say to you that I think Walz's statement was a statement that if you look at the devastation in Gaza and the - a number of people who are dead. I don't think you have to be Republican or Democrat. You say, something is wrong here. You have a human instinct to say, can we get a deal? And you see thousands of Israelis in the street saying, let's get a deal. Let's bring the hostages home.
HAM: But if you say all the right reasons about a group of people who are carrying Hezbollah and Hamas flags and wearing masks, that is a problem. All the right reasons?
WILLIAMS: Stop the - stop the devastation!
BREAM: OK, well, Guy, we talked about the - during the commercial too, that Tim Walz is out there on the campaign trail and he did get a direct question about the death of Hersh Goldberg-Polin and said, OK, thanks, everyone, time to go. I am trying to figure out whether he didn't hear it or whether he does not want to touch that subject.
BENSON: Or any subject, right? They don't do a lot of interviews. They don't answer a lot of questions. And if you watch that particular video that you just referenced, it's - it's weird. He - he stands there. He absolutely clocks the question. You see his brain say, I'm not going to answer it. And he says, all right, thanks, everybody, and walks off with his ice cream. That's a strange response when you're asked about six hostages who have just been killed, including an American.
So, we'll see how he handles that question, if he gets something about that at the vice presidential debate, which I think we're still having. I think it's still on.
BREAM: I think it is. Yes, I hope so. We're looking forward to that one.
In the meantime, there have been protests in the streets in Tel Aviv. I mean thousands and thousands of people gathering as, Juan, you reference this, they want to deal done.
Here's a little bit of what Prime Minister Netanyahu, who is under a ton of pressure, said about trying to get there.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
BENJAMIN NETANYAHU, ISRAELI PRIME MINISTER: It's clear Gaza must be demilitarized. And it can only be demilitarized if the Philadelphi Corridor remains under firm control and is not a - a supply line for armaments and for terror equipment. I think that's clear to most Israelis, to all Israelis.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
BREAM: Susan, this is not an easy problem or - there are no easy solutions or we'd have that cease-fire. Are - are we getting further away or closer to one of those plans (ph)?
PAGE: Here's what's clear, we're not going to have a ceasefire. We're not going to have the kind of deal that the administration has - has been hoping to deliver for some time and some points said we were very close, within days of reaching. And that's because of - of actions on both sides.
Hamas has put new conditions on Israel, and Netanyahu has not been willing to make some of the compromises that the Biden administration wanted them to do. And this is an issue that divides Democrats more than Republicans. You've seen Kamala Harris continue to endorse U.S. support for Israel, not making threats about not continuing arm shipments here, but a kind of tonal shift with Harris in which she expresses more sympathy and concern about the plight of Palestinians. So, I don't know if that's enough to bridge the gap that Democrats have on this issue.
BREAM: I want to play something too from Secretary Blinken who's been traveling in the region again as they try to push towards some kind of ceasefire. Here's what he says about everyone not getting on the same page.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
ANTONY BLINKEN, SECRETARY OF STATE: Every day that goes by where it is not finalized, and the parties don't say, yes, period, is a day in which something else happens. And there is an intervening event, which simply pushes things off and runs the risk of derailing what is a - a pretty fragile apple cart.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
BREAM: Guy, do you agree, that the hopes for a ceasefire are over at this point?
BENSON: Probably because one side doesn't want one. One side wants the other side to be completely obliterated and dead. And they don't just say that, they do it. They did it on October 7th, and they just murdered some more of those hostages that they stole. So, it's really hard to talk about peace or even a temporary peace when one side overtly, explicitly doesn't want one. They're not even Hamas. They're not even at the negotiating table.
We've had this series of offers that Israelis have said yes to, and Hamas had said no every time. And I saw an "Axios" pieces this week saying that the administration, Biden-Harris, might finally be realizing that maybe Hamas doesn't want and deal and is not acting in good faith and it's like, well, if they're coming around to that, it's - it's very late to the party.
WILLIAMS: You know, when you started speaking, I thought you were talking about Israel when you said don't want to deal. I mean, to me, the United States, and the Israelis who are in the streets in Tel Aviv, are putting pressure on the Netanyahu government and saying, we need a deal here. We want to bring our hostages home. They're not aiming their protest at Hamas.
And what we've heard from Netanyahu, in the clip that was just played is, we are intent on keeping troops on this line there with Egypt and Israel in the Gaza. And that is the absolute must, not making a deal. And I think Netanyahu doesn't want a deal because he doesn't want to any - do any favors for the Biden administration.
HAM: Existence is an absolute must, which is why they want to hold that line.
WILLIAMS: Well, they - they will exist. Yes.
BREAM: OK, panel, thank you very much. We'll see you next Sunday.
Up next, those massive demonstrations on the streets of Tel Aviv overnight demanding the Israeli government get a deal done to get the hostages out. And three Israelis shot and killed at a key border crossing overnight. We're going to take you live to Israel, next.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
BREAM: The Israeli government facing mounting pressure as called for a hostage deal intensify, as the country marks 11 months since Hamas' deadly attacks.
Joining us from Tel Aviv, Fox News chief foreign correspondent Trey Yingst with the latest.
Hello, Trey.
TREY YINGST, FOX NEWS CHIEF FOREIGN CORRESPONDENT: Shannon, good morning.
Organizer estimate half a million protesters gathered in the streets of Tel Aviv overnight demanding the release of Israeli hostages. The demonstration marked weekly calls for a ceasefire and hostage release deal, while putting pressure on Israeli Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu. Some of the protesters clashed with police and blocked the main highway that runs through Israel's second-largest city. Similar demonstrations unfolded in Jerusalem and at other locations.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
ZAHIRO SHAHAR MOR, NEPHEW OF ISRAELI HOSTAGE ABRAHAM MUNDER: As long as Netanyahu remains in power, we will keep getting hostages back in body bags. Netanyahu must be removed from power in order to save the lives of the hostages and the country itself.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
YINGST: While chances of an agreement to end the war and bring the hostages home remain low, American negotiators are drafting a new proposal this weekend, trying to close the gaps between the two sides. The latest taking point reportedly has to do with Hamas demanding the release of higher-level Palestinian prisoners in the expected exchange for Israeli captives.
While diplomatic efforts continue, Israel conducted multiple air strikes against Gaza since Friday killing at least a dozen people.
While the southern front remains active, Israel's northern front is still heating up. Dozens of rockets were fired by the Iran-backed group Hezbollah, as daily exchanges of fire are ongoing along the Israel-Lebanon border. No casualties were reported from the attack.
As if the current fronts weren't active enough, today three people were killed when a gunman crossed from Jordan along Israel's eastern border.
Shannon.
BREAM: All right, Trey Yingst reporting live in Israel. We thank you very much, Trey.
And a quit programming note. Tune into "Fox News Democracy `24" special coverage of the ABC presidential debate simulcast. Fox News Channel coverage begins this Tuesday, September 10th, at 8:00 p.m. Eastern Time and right here on your local Fox stations. I'll join you for pregame special at 8:00 p.m. Eastern and post-debate coverage as well.
That is it for us today. Thank you for joining us. I'm Shannon Bream. Have a wonderful week. We'll see you next FOX NEWS SUNDAY.
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